Beta GD&T Engine

[[To...]]

I'm starting to play around with the Beta GD&T Engine in Calypso 7.8.08, in particular the GDT Position of several cylinders with Simultaneous Requirement.  Setting up the SimReq is not the issue.  However, trying to find an efficient way to set up the evaluations per ASME Y14.5 is where I need some help.  Please feel free to correct me on any of my statements. 

First off, the settings in Extras > Measurement > Form Datum, i.e. Outer Tangential for new Datums, or Ref Calculation per ISO 5459 do not pertain to the Beta Version.  In other words, the evaluations on Datum Features come in as "Suggestion".  What does this even mean?  You need to convert every datum feature to Outer Tangential or the proper inscribed or circumscribed evaluation (there is no OTE option for cylinders).  Even the considered feature, should be evaluated using OTE.  What does the "Point Separation" option do?   

The secondary and tertiary datum features also come in with "no constraints" and there is no option to activate them.  Does that mean that Calypso automatically applies the constraint rules of ASME?  Would it not make sense for Calypso to automatically apply all of the proper evaluations and constraints to meet ASME?  Having to check each and every option and setting WASTES time and money.  If there are settings that take of this, I'd appreciate someone pointing this out for me.

 

Below are some minor oddities.

The options for setting RFS/MMC/LMC and Projection is blank (or not showing any default Default, i.e. RFS).  The same applies for a datum feature of size and the options are MMR and LMR.  What is MMR?

 

 

 

 

[[Sh...]]

Nice catch Tom,  I've been using the beta since it came out now and did NOT notice that.

Oopsies

[[Sh...]]

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 you see this man?  

[[Ch...]]

Wow, yeah, interesting stuff, seems GDT Beta Engine has a long way to go in my opinion.

 

 I understand GDT is not easy to begin with and to math it all out is more of a challenge, but yeah I think they should be a bit more advanced than where they are, other softwares are I believe.

 

It's coming along, we just have to have patience I suppose.

 

MMR = Max Mat'l Requirement ?   I believe that is ISO 1101 - never heard it in ASME Y14.5

 

https://www.engineersedge.com/geometric_boundaries/maximum-material-requirement-mmr.htm#:~:text=Maximum Material Requirement MMR - Maximum,size and maximum shaft size.

 

 

 

 

Edited November 20, 2024

[[Di...]]

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Hi Chris,

regarding MMR. It is the ISO name for the Maximum Material Requirement (ASME=Maximum Material Boundary). As ISO is an international standard and ASME only a national standard, iSO guides the terminology and abbreviations here.

Edited November 22, 2024

[[To...]]

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Greetings Dinko,

I agree that ISO should guide the ISO version of Calypso but if the software is able to be configured to follow the ASME system, shouldn't the terminology and interpretation follow the ASME standard?

Edited November 22, 2024

[[Di...]]

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There is no ISO or ASME version of CALYPSO. It is only a general setting of the new GD&T engine that defines how the results are computed. Either based on ASME or on ISO.  As the old terminology for example led to confusion with some languages it was decided to internationalize the abbreviations and terminology for every language to make it understandable anywhere. Also the added symbology helps to avoid misunderstandings.

Nevertheless, the computation methods are not affected by this. The methods change automatically when you switch from ISO to ASME setting. So it is always assured that you get the correct results according to the selected standards, its tolerances, modifiers etc.

Edited November 22, 2024

[[Ma...]]

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I got an idea for wishlist - It would be nice to have a switch per program to have all settings for evaluation for ASME or ISO as default so you would only on start set which rules you want to apply and then all new features and characteristics would apply ASME or ISO rules

[[To...]]

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This is already possible starting with 2023.  You need to activate the "Beta GD&T Engine" in the Extras > Settings > Miscellaneous window.  Then, you can set the default standard in Extras > Settings > Measurement window.  In the Characteristics Settings Editor, you can toggle the standard for a particular measurement plan.

Edited November 22, 2024

[[Ch...]]

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Yes, I actually requested this some years back on MyVoice portal, makes perfect sense right ?

 

[[Ri...]]

Tom, 

I am confused, when you have it set to ASME or ISO it is using what the Standard is saying you should use - that is what the Suggestion is. You can click on the light bulb at the bottom to see what evaluation methods it is using. 

As for the ISO5459 requirements, I believe it is applying this be default. I have compared results out of the new GD&T engine and Inspect using the same data set. 

For the most part, if you are wanting to follow the standard, there isn't a lot of work that needs to be done. 

At least Calypso allows you to change the evaluation parameters, Inspect isn't as friendly. Lol. 

[[To...]]

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Richard,  Thank you for explaining things.  The light bulb was very helpful, though there wasn't any indication of a datum shift. (Even in the Default Printout).  I don't even know how other software programs handle this.  I feel the term "suggestion" is a bit confusing. Why not just show what the actual evaluation is.  

Can you control the output of the diameter characteristics used for the MMC and MMB?  It automatically adds these characteristics without the ability to rename it or control where they should be in the report.  It appears you will need to duplicate the characteristic if you want to use a particular name or have it in a particular location.  On the topic of names, is there a way to control the output of the characteristic names and the addition of (SimReq1)?  I suppose, I could create a custom template to allow for longer names.